Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

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bobfells

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostThu Nov 03, 2011 2:35 pm

Excellent work, Gagman! I've been putting the finishing touches on my third book in the Arliss series, MORE ARLISS ARCHIVES, due out in January. I'll be turning to the sequel to OLD HOLLYWOOD IN COLOR and posting a number of photos here for feedback. BTW, I asked James Robert Parish, a prolific author of film books, to critique OLD HOLLYWOOD. He liked it but more importantly, he came up with a term that doesn't have the negative, Ted Turner-ish connotation that "colorization" does. He calls what we do "color transfers." I LIKE that!!
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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostFri Nov 04, 2011 12:08 am

Bob,

:o OK, I guess I never understood that you actually published a complete book of photos? How much does it sell for? Glad you liked the stills from EMPTY HANDS, and FOUR WALLS. Are you working on the ROSE MARIE still? I skipped over that one, because you had indicated that you planned to work on it yourself.


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Esther And Jacko-"Say, No Peeking Under My Lid Sweetie!"


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Betty Compson-"Flapper At Thought"


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Clara Bow-"Place My Bet"
Last edited by Gagman 66 on Fri Nov 04, 2011 12:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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bobfells

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostFri Nov 04, 2011 12:25 am

Gagman 66 wrote:Bob,

:o OK, I guess I never understood that you actually published a complete book of photos? How much does it sell for? Glad you liked the stills from EMPTY HANDS, and FOUR WALLS. Are you working on the ROSE MARIE still? I skipped over that one, because you had indicated that you planned to work on it yourself.


Nice photos, Gagman, as always. I'm working on the ROSE MARIE photo but stopped to finish the new Arliss book, so please feel free to tackle it yourself. It would be fun to compare since you seem to use pastels whereas I'm in the primary colors. Here's where I left off:
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I published THE ARLISS ARCHIVES in Sept and OLD HOLLYWOOD IN COLOR in October. Both are on Amazon and will be offered to online and retail bookstores, universities and libraries. The list price is $40 for ARCHIVES but Amazon has discounted it to $28. I think they will do the same with OLD HOLLYWOOD. Both books are in full color and 8.5x11 inches bound paperback. Nice production job.

I guess nobody will be offended if I show the covers here:

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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostFri Nov 04, 2011 12:36 am

Bob,

I'll try to purchase both of them eventually. May be awhile. I do need to register on your Web-site.

I'll work on ROSE MARIE this weekend. With the Betty Compson still, which appears to be from WEARY RIVER, I'm still not very happy with the skin-tones, but the main problem was the shade of the Stockings. I think those turned out great though. There is just something else about the photo that is frustrating me. Maybe it is hue of the chair. I'm not real sure. The Clara Bow by contrast, I thought turned out fairly well. Even her Blush.


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Rolph The Terrier-(1925) :)


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Emil Jannings and Esther Ralston-Betrayal-(1929)
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostFri Nov 04, 2011 7:45 am

I assume that BETRAYAL is another lost Paramount. Geez! I like the puppy photo - it reminded me of the Dogville shorts circa 1929-30 when they all stand and walk around on their hind legs. One shot gave the game away - the dogs wore harnesses connected to a wire to help them stand up. I'm wondering if that's the case in your photo?

I think the problem with your Compton photo is the purple or violet color of the leather chair. I took a try at it only to make the leather a standard black. Overall, you've got a lot of color detail in the photo, maybe too much. The shoe color matches the rug. Why not have her shoes match her dress and leave the rug as is. I'm learning that less is more. In the ROSE MARIE photo I would not color every item in the background, for example.

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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostFri Nov 04, 2011 10:57 am

Bob,

I like the chair Black. Looks quite good. I just could not get it to look that way. The shoes are not the same shade of green as the carpet, but I agree this is a problem. Yes, Betrayal was a Paramount feature with Jannings, Ralston, and Gary Cooper, directed by Lewis Milestone. Probably one of the last Paramount Silents, or Goat-Glands.


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Molly O'Day- "Elegant Young Flapper"-1926


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Anita Page-"Youth And Beauty"-1928
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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostSun Nov 06, 2011 11:12 am

Bob,

:? So did you finish the Rose Marie still yet? Here are a couple shots I had planned on working with for many months. Finally did so. The Rudy is pretty intense. You say that I use pastel's, but really I just use what I use. Don't know how to do anything different. If I ever get new software, I probably will be confused how it works.


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Rudy and Vilma-"Passionate Embrace"-from SON OF THE SHEIK-1926


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John Barrymore And Dolores Costello from WHEN A MAN LOVES (1927)
Last edited by Gagman 66 on Sun Nov 06, 2011 10:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostSun Nov 06, 2011 9:35 pm

Gagman,I won't be getting around to ROSE MARIE for a couple weeks at least because I'm finishing the new Arliss book so any color transfers are being done there for the moment. I really like your latest two color transfers (let's try to coin this term) although I wonder why Barrymore has white hair and Vilma Banky seems to have blue eyelids. If her eyes are supposed to be half open, the color doesn't really work. I first viewed this on my Blackberry and Vilma's eyes looked closed. I think it works better that way.

Here are two sequels from earlier posts. First, another young Bogart scanned from a work negative:
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Following up on that Astor-Gable photo from RED DUST, here's Harlow-Gable from RED DUST:
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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostSun Nov 06, 2011 9:53 pm

Bob,

Wow! The Gable and Harlow is sensational! Great stuff. Bogie looks great, except for the shirt sleeve where you have some crawling color. Looks like the moth's chewed it to shreds! Not easily fixed.

On Vilma, I only placed a blue dot where I thought that the eye was visible. Vilma's eyes did not appear shut to me. There is no blue eye shadow. With Barrymore, I lost his hair a couple times there, but was able to locate it. Didn't think it was that gray.

The July 1925 Issue of Photo-play magazine had the now completely forgotten May Allison pegged as one of the Top 10 most beautiful actresses of the screen. Undoubtedly those very large, expressively clear eyes had a allot to do with the selection. Pretty lady. This pic jumped out at me. Love the head scarf.

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May Allison-"Five Foot Two, Eyes Of Blue"


Hey, Do know who these two people are? The girl is Mondo Good Looking! Wow! Had the still in a stray file for a long time and it was not labeled. Would appreciate any help. Thanks.


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Unidentified Guy and Gal On A Train
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bobfells

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostSun Nov 06, 2011 10:09 pm

The angle of her face makes an ID tough but I'll hazard a guess and say Mary Astor.

I fiddled with your Barrymore photo. I didn't change any of your colors but did an overlay with a few of my own. For easy comparison, here's Gagman color:
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and bobfells color:
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostSun Nov 06, 2011 10:27 pm

Gagman wrote: Bogie looks great, except for the shirt sleeve where you have some crawling color. Looks like the moth's chewed it to shreds! Not easily fixed.

The original neg indicated a bit of arm could be seen through an opening by the cuff but you're right, it looks like a moth had lunch there. So in this instance, I would have to add a bit of shirt sleeve that's not really there but it can be fixed w/o too much effort:
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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostSun Nov 06, 2011 10:57 pm

Bob,

:cry: The Barrymore is a little to harsh now for my delicate sensibilities. But yeah, the Cat is probably a Tabby like Morris. Not an Ally beast! I'll need to fix that part. The flowers probably should be white, but I didn't touch them at all.

Have an awesome photo I am working on now, and I don't know who it is of either. Mary Astor? Really, my first thought was either Gertrude Olmsted, or Jobyna Ralston, Though I don't think I'm right.

Here is a lovely shot of Olive Thomas.

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Meanwhile, this picture is apparently of Martha Mansfield? Anyone have additional info?

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Martha Mansfield-"Princess Of The Book"
Last edited by Gagman 66 on Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostMon Nov 07, 2011 8:39 am

Gagman, beautiful work all. That candle flame has a sinister connotation with Martha's dress so near.

I toned down the intensity on the Barrymore photo:
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostMon Nov 07, 2011 9:54 am

Anita Page looks like she has some dental problems.
Dick May
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostMon Nov 07, 2011 11:53 am

Dick,

I assumed that Anita is wearing braces. In fairness to Gagman, I'll bet the original b/w has the same issue. I applied some of those Crest Whitening strips to get this results:
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostMon Nov 07, 2011 12:29 pm

:( On that still, Anita's teeth were not easy to do anything with. I thought I brought them out about as best as could be done. Better than having them dark gray or a even light green or blue hue.

We have apparently determined who the couple are on the train. See if anyone agrees? I still do not know the movie.


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Myrna Loy and Pat O' Mally Sr.?
Last edited by Gagman 66 on Mon Nov 07, 2011 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostMon Nov 07, 2011 4:37 pm

Gagman, a quick check of Mary Astor's films at imdb shows one with Pat O'Malley, THE FIGHTING AMERICAN (1924). BTW, I noticed that Mary was teamed with Lloyd Hughes in quite a number of films in the mid and late 20s. Sadly, I think the survival rate for her silents is pretty low.
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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostMon Nov 07, 2011 5:23 pm

Bob,

:o I rifled through hundreds of photos of Myrna Loy, including many from the 20's. Came to the conclusion it likely was not her. So you might be right about Mary Astor., and you may have discovered the film as well. Thanks.

I've actually seen at least 9 or 10 of Mary Astor's Silent's, so there are quite a few that do survive.

This Sally O'Neil Candid has the same problem as the Anita Page. Here her mouth is slightly open, and the teeth are barely visible, but dark and hard to find. In this case, I did not try to bring them out, but probably should have.


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Sally O 'Neil-"Our Miss Cloverleaf of 1927"


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John Gilbert and Phyllis Haver-1924
Last edited by Gagman 66 on Tue Nov 08, 2011 6:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostMon Nov 07, 2011 9:05 pm

Gagman,

Reading your latest post I realize that I had a senior moment but with a positive results. I meant to check imdb for Myrna Loy films with Pat O'Malley but obviously I had Mary on my mind. I have to agree that the gal in the photo does resemble Myrna too. Could you possibly recall the titles of the Mary Astor silents you've seen? You can skip those I've seen such as BEAU BRUMMEL, OH DOCTOR!, DON Q SON OF ZORRO, DON JUAN, and TWO ARABIAN KNIGHTS. I ask because I'm devoting a chapter to her in my next OLD HD book . Thanks.
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostMon Nov 07, 2011 10:14 pm

Bob,

:) Two more Silents with Mary Astor that quickly come to mind are THE FIGHTING COWARD (1924), and ROMANCE OF THE UNDERWORLD (1928). I'll see what else I can recall.

Oh, by the way, I adjusted the skin-tone on the RINTY still of Dorothy Gulliver, so she is not so pink. When I fiddled with it before, I think the arms got a little to saturated.

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And here is one of the more sensual portraits you will ever see of Lillian Gish:

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Lillian-"Provocative Gaze"
Last edited by Gagman 66 on Tue Nov 08, 2011 8:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostTue Nov 08, 2011 7:39 am

Gagman, Dorothy's arms look fine now but her face seems too pink. Of course, Rinty looks like he's almost in 3-D. Thanks.
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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostTue Nov 08, 2011 10:39 am

Bob,

:o I didn't touch the face at all this time. It is the same as before. I only adjusted the arms, which were very pink. I still could not find a film with Myrna Loy and Pat O' Mally Sr. listed. Though there may have been one. It may still be Myrna? For now, I'll stick with Mary Astor until I find out otherwise.

Speaking of Myrna. Any idea when this was taken.


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Also I fiddled a little bit with your Harlow and Gable last night. The bright brown background didn't quite work for me. In addition, I put a little more highlight on the lace of her dress. Hope you like it.

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On the Pickford Radio program still at Pic-Fair with Errol Flynn, you missed the reflection in the mirror table top for some reason. I filled that part in. See what you think.

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Tinkered with the Harry Carey too. Who is this girl with him? His Daughter? Tried to bring out her eyes more. But I am taking some pot shots for my zombie eyes elsewhere. On my monitor it looks fine. With the Sally O'Neil, that was a very soft image to start with and the eyes turned out awful. Now I can see that this gals are to bright blue.

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:-[ This precious photo shows darling Sisters Sally O' Neil and Molly O' Day together. But who is who? They both look alike! More like Twins than just Sisters. Awful cute girls! I have included the tinted original as I found it, and my newly colorized version. Or "Color Transfer" version. A term that seems less offensive to some people than "colorized". I think Sally is on the right. Hard to tell for sure.

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Sally O' Neil and Molly O' Day- "Sweet Sister Dear"


OK< go back and check the RINTY photo again. I toned down the face of the girl. I also extended the flesh a little lower cut-before it hits the mesh. Hopefully, it's about right now?
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Sally & Molly

PostWed Nov 09, 2011 3:55 am

Gagman 66 wrote: Sisters Sally O' Neil and Molly O' Day together. [/b] But who is who? They both look alike! More like Twins than just Sisters. Awful cute girls! I have included the tinted original as I found it, and my newly colorized version.... I think Sally is on the right. Hard to tell for sure.



I agree they're both beautiful ladies, but I've never had any trouble telling them apart.
In these photos Sally is on the left and Molly is at the right.

And by the way, the still is from the 1927 MGM movie THE LOVELORN.
Last edited by Richard Finegan on Wed Nov 09, 2011 1:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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silent Mary Astor short

PostWed Nov 09, 2011 4:01 am

bobfells wrote:Could you possibly recall the titles of the Mary Astor silents you've seen? You can skip those I've seen such as BEAU BRUMMEL, OH DOCTOR!, DON Q SON OF ZORRO, DON JUAN, and TWO ARABIAN KNIGHTS. I ask because I'm devoting a chapter to her in my next OLD HD book . Thanks.


For the record, I've seen the 1922 silent short THE YOUNG PAINTER with Mary Astor.
A friend has a 16mm print of it. Not sure how rare it is, but if you're keeping track of extant silent Mary Astor films, I thought you may want to know about that one.
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostFri Nov 11, 2011 12:14 am

Thanks, Richard. I've gotten ahold of ROMANCE OF THE UNDERWORLD and THE FIGHTING COWARD but now I'll have to see if I can track down THE YOUNG PAINTER. I assume Mary has a small role in that one. I'm devoting a chapter to her in my new book that will mainly focus on the silent era.

Gagman, I like the touch ups you did on my photos. I seem to get the most compliments for the Harry Carey photo even though I caption it to note that it is an original color photo! But I'll take any praise I can get even if it's under false pretenses. The gal is Betty Field and it's a portrait from THE SHEPHERD OF THE HILLS (1941) and was filmed in Technicolor. It's been out on dvd ( and looks great) in a five film Universal collection of John Wayne films. SEVEN SINNERS is another good one in the set with Marlene Dietrich.

Here's one I did for a chapter on horror film stars:
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From left to right Edward Van Sloan as Prof. Van Helsing, David Manners as Jonathan Harker, Helen Chandler as Mina, and of course Bela Lugosi as DRACULA (1931).
Last edited by bobfells on Fri Nov 11, 2011 7:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Gagman 66

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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostFri Nov 11, 2011 2:53 am

Bob,

:o Great work, but who are these people? Bela is the only one I recognize? Just slipped in here for a minute because I couldn't sleep. But as soon as I get up I start getting tired? Ha. Ha. Whoops, I missed that the Carey was an original color photo? I'll need to revisit the site over the weekend.

Here's a favorite of Colleen Moore. that was not in my Slideshow.

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"Jeannine Lost In Lilac Time"
Last edited by Gagman 66 on Tue Feb 07, 2012 10:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostFri Nov 11, 2011 7:26 am

Gagman, I captioned the DRACULA photo to identify the players.
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George Arliss in THE KING'S VACATION (1933)

PostFri Nov 11, 2011 3:09 pm

THE KING’S VACATION (1933) on TCM, Monday, Nov. 14 @10:30am ET

This photo was scanned from an 8x10 work negative:
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Patricia Ellis, Dick Powell and George Arliss

This was scanned from an original 8x10 still:
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Dudley Digges, who was Arliss' stage manager in the 1910s, and Mr. A

Hope you can catch this film!
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostWed Nov 16, 2011 9:16 pm

I've finished the new book and awaiting the proof to check. So I've turned to completing the ROSE MARIE (1928) photo:
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Here's a new one - Richard Barthelmess and Mary Astor in THE LASH (1930), which I believe is lost:
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and the only teaming of Bette Davis and Edward G. Robinson in KID GALAHAD (1937):
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I scanned all three images directly from 8x10 work negatives
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Re: Color from Black-and-White: colorized photos

PostWed Nov 16, 2011 10:47 pm

TCM has shown THE LASH, so it's happily still with us.
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