Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

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TerryC
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by TerryC » Mon Sep 08, 2014 10:51 pm

I have just finished watching this set and I too am having a mixed reaction to it. I noticed while watching the Rink how bleached out and over-exposed it is. Edna is playing with a white cat that you can hardly see, because the image is so bleached out. Just for fun, I popped a copy of the same movie from my Image boxed DVD set and it actually looked much better with the cat clearly visible. The entire movie is less detailed being a DVD of course but looks to be much less scratched. Is this version from a different source (possibly 16 mm)? I know that these new Blu-rays are from 35 mm but if they are so damaged that the extra details do not make up for what is lost, what is the point? This is like playing a 78 rpm record on a very expensive turntable. You get to hear (in this case see) the scratches in state of the art quality. Most of the other movies look very good, especially The Immigrant ironically enough, but they also seem to show much more wear than I ever noticed before.

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luciano
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by luciano » Tue Sep 09, 2014 3:46 am

TerryC wrote:I have just finished watching this set and I too am having a mixed reaction to it. I noticed while watching the Rink how bleached out and over-exposed it is. Edna is playing with a white cat that you can hardly see, because the image is so bleached out. Just for fun, I popped a copy of the same movie from my Image boxed DVD set and it actually looked much better with the cat clearly visible. The entire movie is less detailed being a DVD of course but looks to be much less scratched. Is this version from a different source (possibly 16 mm)? I know that these new Blu-rays are from 35 mm but if they are so damaged that the extra details do not make up for what is lost, what is the point? This is like playing a 78 rpm record on a very expensive turntable. You get to hear (in this case see) the scratches in state of the art quality. Most of the other movies look very good, especially The Immigrant ironically enough, but they also seem to show much more wear than I ever noticed before.
I know I had a slight problem with that at one point. We own a 40inch plasma and it has quite a few different settings on it that seem to provide the best quality for certain films. The Chaplin Mutuals looked best on the Cinema setting, which adds a great deal of warmth and evens out the contrast nicely. Here's some photos taken directly off our TV. I guess you could compare them and see if the settings need to be tweaked.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127607002 ... 187043532/" target="_blank

https://www.flickr.com/photos/127607002 ... otostream/" target="_blank

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Smari1989
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by Smari1989 » Tue Sep 09, 2014 5:03 am

BEHIND THE SCREEN is hilarious with the new Robert Israel-score. Wonderful. I always liked the film, of course, as I do with all of Chaplin's Mutuals, but not as much as several of the others, and I didn't revisit it that often. I expect that to change now, with the new score.

TerryC
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by TerryC » Tue Sep 09, 2014 8:54 am

Re: Washed out appearance of the Rink. I have 55" and a 45" flat screen TVs and the film on Blu-ray looked washed out on both. I have to admit however that I only very rarely tweak the settings. I always find one generic one and use it for everything. I will have to try the different settings and "report" back.

DougMac
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by DougMac » Wed Sep 10, 2014 11:38 am

I do think that "The Rink" looks hot. The problem is that if the source is bleached out, making the print darker will only make the whites look muddy. It's hard to second guess the restorers without seeing the source material.

I'm projecting this on a 10 foot screen so the wear and tear is obvious. While I'd love these films to look as clean as "City Lights", I'm just thankful we still have them, considering how much from the silent era has been lost forever.

MikeH0714
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by MikeH0714 » Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:13 pm

TerryC wrote:I have just finished watching this set and I too am having a mixed reaction to it. I noticed while watching the Rink how bleached out and over-exposed it is. Edna is playing with a white cat that you can hardly see, because the image is so bleached out. Just for fun, I popped a copy of the same movie from my Image boxed DVD set and it actually looked much better with the cat clearly visible. The entire movie is less detailed being a DVD of course but looks to be much less scratched. Is this version from a different source (possibly 16 mm)? I know that these new Blu-rays are from 35 mm but if they are so damaged that the extra details do not make up for what is lost, what is the point? This is like playing a 78 rpm record on a very expensive turntable. You get to hear (in this case see) the scratches in state of the art quality. Most of the other movies look very good, especially The Immigrant ironically enough, but they also seem to show much more wear than I ever noticed before.
As has been mentioned earlier in this thread, and in other threads, this restoration was made from 35mm silent aperture prints struck from the original camera negatives, mainly A (domestic) and sometimes B (foreign) when it was unavoidable. Regarding THE RINK looking washed out, David Shepard wrote (on page 3 of this thread): "The original nitrate print of THE RINK had severe emulsion fading (hypoing). The problem is in the source, the scan is more or less a miraculous recovery."

The reason THE RINK looks "better" in the Image DVD is that it was made mostly from the much younger Van Beuren/Commonwealth elements, which were not silent aperture because they had soundtracks. The downside is that Van Beuren made cuts. Lots of them. I watched THE VAGABOND last night and realized that VB had made even more cuts than I'd detailed in CHAPLIN'S VINTAGE YEAR.

I mentioned in another thread that there are two approaches to restoration: 1) Use every frame you can, regardless of generation, gauge or aperture, to get the film complete (see TILLIE'S PUNCTURED ROMANCE), or 2) Use the best, earliest original source material you can, regardless of completeness, to reconstruct the film as closely as possible to the original without jarring visual discrepancies that can take casual viewers out of the movie.

The parties involved in the Mutual set went with 2), and in this case I think they're right. These films are much too iconic to be presented in a way that may distract audiences, especially since these versions are also DCPs currently appearing in theaters and winning new fans.

Michael Hayde

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sc1957
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by sc1957 » Wed Sep 10, 2014 12:53 pm

The Rink is also available on the recent Criterion Modern Times disc (both DVD and Blu-ray). I wonder if anyone has compared these two versions?
Scott Cameron

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jjbluecaps
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by jjbluecaps » Wed Sep 10, 2014 1:35 pm

The Rink on the Criterion DVD is the same from the Image Entertainment DVD.

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FlickerAlley
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by FlickerAlley » Thu Apr 27, 2017 3:43 pm

Image

Thanks everyone for your patience. We're happy to announce Chaplin's Mutual Comedies 5-disc Blu-ray/DVD set is back in stock and discounted over 40% off.

R Michael Pyle
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by R Michael Pyle » Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:07 pm

Thanks! Finally purchased this. I just discarded all my old VHS tapes of these.

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bigshot
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by bigshot » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:04 am

Have the out of sync soundtracks been corrected in the new pressing?

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FlickerAlley
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by FlickerAlley » Fri Apr 28, 2017 11:13 am

bigshot wrote:Have the out of sync soundtracks been corrected in the new pressing?
Hi, thanks for your question. The content is the same as the previous edition. The set includes an alternate piano score for all films.

HitchcockLang
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by HitchcockLang » Mon May 08, 2017 10:28 am

For those of us who bought this the first time around but are not fans of steelbooks, is there anyway to get the new slip case packaging (presumably the same as the Essanay set)?

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bigshot
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by bigshot » Sat Nov 04, 2017 12:56 am

I have a question about the various versions of the Chaplin Mutuals. I've triple dipped on these... Flicker Alley, Spanish and UK. I know the Spanish is redundant to the UK version, but is there anything on the Flicker Alley set (other than the tin can) that makes it a keeper? Supplements perhaps?

Paul Penna
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by Paul Penna » Sat Nov 04, 2017 8:39 am

bigshot wrote:I have a question about the various versions of the Chaplin Mutuals. I've triple dipped on these... Flicker Alley, Spanish and UK. I know the Spanish is redundant to the UK version, but is there anything on the Flicker Alley set (other than the tin can) that makes it a keeper? Supplements perhaps?
This site lists the contents of all three:

http://www.dvdcompare.net/comparisons/f ... ?fid=31852

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bigshot
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by bigshot » Sun Nov 05, 2017 1:15 pm

Looks like if I keep blu-ray disc 2 from the Flicker Alley and the BFI set, I can safely jettison the rest. They'll make nice stocking stuffers this Christmas.

monks19
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by monks19 » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:07 am

Will a Blu-Ray edition of the Keystone period be available (eventually) ?

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bigshot
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Re: Flicker Alley Chaplin Mutuals

Unread post by bigshot » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:54 am

Doubt it will anytime soon. Perhaps Cineteca Bologna might take that on.

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