New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

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Scott J
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New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Sat Oct 14, 2017 7:55 pm

Announcing a new website for this classic - https://www.phantom1925.com/. My primary intention is for it to be a digital museum of sorts and to acquire & share high quality and interesting materials relating to the film.

So let me know what you think. I'm open to suggestions and submissions. :)

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Red Bartlett
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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Red Bartlett » Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:56 pm

Very nice!

Just this afternoon I pulled the BFI blu-ray off the shelf for it's annual viewings. It has the best '25 version I believe, and/or the only one in HD. If there's a better version out there, I'm all in.

My only recommendation would be to keep your site "relevant" as they say. Continue to curate the web -- point to sites and forums and threads that discuss the topic. Make this the one-stop-shop for the 1925 Phantom!

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by sherry » Sun Oct 15, 2017 1:02 am

Thanks for letting us know!
Love the Miscellaneous Clippings section.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scoundrel » Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:50 am

Very Nice ... !!!!
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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by bobfells » Sun Oct 15, 2017 12:31 pm

Very impressive Scott, your website is already well developed. Suggestion: you might want to join our FB group, Lon Chaney Man of 1,000 Faces, if you want to spread the word. I also PM'ed you on your site.
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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by radiotelefonia » Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:43 pm

Image

Image

Image

Image

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by wich2 » Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:53 am

Scott, continued best.

It has always mystified me, in this era of "Let's REALLY Restore The Classics," that this Original Release (and Best Cut) doesn't get the majority love it deserves.

-Craig

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Red Bartlett » Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:02 pm

wich2 wrote:Scott, continued best.

It has always mystified me, in this era of "Let's REALLY Restore The Classics," that this Original Release (and Best Cut) doesn't get the majority love it deserves.

-Craig
So true. The '25 version is usually all I watch now. And it's typically tacked on as a "regular definition" extra to the (better-print) lesser and chopped up '29 franken-version. The BFI Bluray is the only recent release that includes a high-def version at least, so that's my go-to. But it's a beat up copy for sure. I guess that's all there is? -- is there only one known version of the original '25?

I'm not sure how much can be done -- but I always imagined there would be a way to include some of the better source material and fragments that's available in the '29.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by MaryGH » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:11 pm

Looks awesome!

An idea, if not already done:

Get some social media pages just for your site, it'll be a great way to spread the word.
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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by wich2 » Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:57 pm

Red Bartlett wrote:I'm not sure how much can be done -- but I always imagined there would be a way to include some of the better source material and fragments that's available in the '29.
Red, have you not seen Scott's estimable tests? A very good deal can be done!

-Craig

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:43 pm

Thank you everyone for the enthusiasm! :) I'll definitely take your ideas and see what I can do.

And thank you radiotelefonia! I haven't seen some of those before. I'll put them up on the site :)

As for Raoul and the Ballerinas. That picture has always driven me crazy. Such high resolution but compressed something awful. I could never find a better copy. So seeing it again reminded me of something I wanted to do with it.

So we have this:
Image

I came across this:
Image

I used my bag of tricks and now we have this - I'll call it a "special edition" since it's not "historically accurate" to the original lobby card
Image

I've pumped up and toned the colors that were already there, and added the missing ballerina and tried to match her. You can now see most of the ladies' faces instead of them being an overcompressed, pixelated mess. I'm hoping a better scan turns up online, but if not, at least we have a better copy now ;)

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by radiotelefonia » Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:51 am

Nice work:

I originally lifted the image of Norman Kerry and the ballerinas from this magazine.

http://mls.bireme.br/_popup_pdf.php?dat ... 03|06|0261" target="_blank

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Red Bartlett
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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Red Bartlett » Tue Oct 17, 2017 8:56 am

wich2 wrote:
Red Bartlett wrote:I'm not sure how much can be done -- but I always imagined there would be a way to include some of the better source material and fragments that's available in the '29.
Red, have you not seen Scott's estimable tests? A very good deal can be done!

-Craig
You know, I think I have... now that you mention it. I remember seeing something on YouTube where someone stabilized the image and such. It was a quick example, but it did look remarkably better.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Tue Oct 17, 2017 6:53 pm

radiotelefonia wrote:Nice work:

I originally lifted the image of Norman Kerry and the ballerinas from this magazine.

http://mls.bireme.br/_popup_pdf.php?dat ... 03|06|0261" target="_blank" target="_blank
Glad you like it, and thank you for sharing the source. Kinda funny that they flipped it horizontally. More interesting pages in there too that I can use. :)

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:41 pm

Update - I have a fundraiser going for rare stills of the film. https://www.gofundme.com/phantom-of-the ... 925-stills

Additional information is in the Crowdfunding Sub-Forum http://nitrateville.com/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=25515

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by silentfilm » Mon Jan 22, 2018 12:31 pm

Image
Caption: The Scorpion or the Grasshopper!

I've only got one Phantom still in my collection, but you are welcome to add it to your project. If you need it at a higher dpi and without the watermark, I'll have to rescan it for you.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Darren Nemeth » Mon Jan 22, 2018 1:01 pm

I have 600dpi scans of a number of original Phantom stereoviews I used to have on a harddrive somewhere. If interested let me know and I will look for them.

And also there is album on my facebook page where I assembled frames from two versions of Phantom to make 3D photos.

https://www.facebook.com/1966.Batman.Ba ... 387&type=3" target="_blank" target="_blank

If interested in the original, better resolution files let me know.
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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Mon Jan 22, 2018 1:15 pm

Thank you Bruce and Darren! You both have a PM! :)

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by missdupont » Mon Jan 22, 2018 4:25 pm

Please do not colorize the photos. Jack and Roman Freulich shot in black and white, and it should remain in black and white. That's obviously what they and Universal wanted.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Mon Jan 22, 2018 8:16 pm

No worries - I adore the black & white photography - it's iconic and gorgeous. Almost 100 years old and it only gets better with age! :)

In cases such as the "Raoul and the Ballerinas" image, I only did the color version because a magazine from that era used a colorized version to advertise the film. It's in line with other colorized material used to advertise the film back in 1925, like the lobby cards. I've recently found an original black and white still of that shot which is even better than the composite I made and it will be featured alongside the other black and white photos.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Tue Jan 23, 2018 1:00 am

I updated the fundraiser with new reward levels and resolutions. Should be a little something for everyone now.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Tue Jan 23, 2018 5:51 pm

Does anyone know which film format these stills were taken with? Below is a 1:1 crop of a 1200dpi scan of this image - you may have to open the cropped image in another window or download it to see the full size. Being that these stills were made directly off the camera negative, the detail is beautiful. From the looks of it, a 1200dpi scan cannot resolve all the detail here.

Image
Image

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Danny Burk » Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:19 pm

Professional studio stills were normally shot on 8x10 negs.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by All Darc » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:45 am

These still negatives had great quality and resolution.

I Hope there is a preservation program to save it. Many stills negatives and prints today are in the hand of collectors.

Do you have a picture of a typical negative plate and the cameras used to shoot it during silent era ?

Manby films that survived in poor prints ahve some great stills to help give a idea about the sets.
Danny Burk wrote:Professional studio stills were normally shot on 8x10 negs.
Keep thinking...

Image

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Danny Burk » Thu Jan 25, 2018 1:00 pm

An 8x10 (i.e. using an 8 inch by 10 inch sheet of film) would be called a view camera or large format camera - either is correct. It was the standard professional format at the time; 5x7 and 4x5 were also around then, but considered somewhat inferior since film stock wasn't quite as good as it became in later years. Nowadays, 4x5 is the "standard" large format; 8x10 (and even larger) formats are still around, but are nowhere near as common as 4x5.

In the digital age nowadays, a view camera isn't mainstream anymore; even before the digital takeover, 35mm cameras were the "popular" format, with large format being a speciality item used to obtain the highest quality, especially for landscape, architecture, and studio work. I shot 4x5 landscape for many years until, due to a number of reasons, I converted to digital and sold my film equipment in 2015. I don't have a photo of an 8x10 camera handy (you can easily find many via a Google search), but here's a shot of my own personal camera, an Ebony SV45U2. It's a gorgeous camera, made in Japan from Ebony wood and titanium. The style is very similar to an 8x10 except in size, and in fact the entire basic setup has changed little since the late 19th Century.

Image

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by All Darc » Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:08 pm

Nice !

Iimagine what resolution a 8x10 negative plate from 20's have. Maybe up to to 8K or more.
Keep thinking...

Image

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Scott J » Mon Jan 29, 2018 1:43 pm

There's definitely more than 8k (around 33 megapixels) worth of detail in these 8x10s struck off the original negatives. I purchased a couple prints from this collector to make sure he was legit. When scanning these prints, they out-resolve 800 DPI which is roughly 51 megapixels for an 8x10 - at least according to what I've read. I'm now staying around 1400 DPI scans to be safe. The exposure time for these older 8x10 plates usually result in motion blur for the actors, so there is that caveat.

For another example of detail, you may have seen this image in film books:
Image

And here's a crop from an original print made off the negative:
Image

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Danny Burk » Mon Jan 29, 2018 3:12 pm

If you're scanning negs, they can hold information up to 4000 dpi, which is the standard amount that I use for drum scanning. That's assuming that lenses and sharpness, etc. are good; it could be less than the modern standard that I've indicated due to lesser-quality lenses.

Scanned prints (rather than negs or transparencies) hold about 300 dpi worth of detail.

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by All Darc » Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:56 pm

Nice still ! I never saw this photo before.

Depending how the paper photograph print was made, it can have even more closer details from the original negative. A huge paper photo, like double diameter of the negative, it's easier to set a perfect focus, while a small photo can be difficult, specially in vintage equipment and if the photographer had myopia.

I believe that in theory it's possible, in future, to add detail to moving pictrures, like adding fine textures, to increase the resolution. It could be made in a way that after reduce resolution again, the image would be the same as before. This would be interesting to the industry if they deicded to get money with a kind of Imax Star Wars. The same thing could help recover detail from movies shot in 35mm but survived only in 16mm. Production stills could be used as reference for fine details and textures of sets, costumes etc...

For the Phantom of The Opera 1925, I think the most iconic and nice stills form the movie are also the most difficult to find in good versions, like with lower contrast (fine dynamic range). Look these couple examples .
The first have a bit better contrast, but not so much, on Getty Images or so, and the second I found a low contrast, but somewhat dark, in a very compressed jpeg file with some "almost HD" resolution. But here I'm posting the versions usually found on Google :

Image

Image

Here the lower contrast (despite be a overexposed scan and clipped whites), I found right now on Alamy :
http://c7.alamy.com/comp/DRMYB6/the-pha ... DRMYB6.jpg" target="_blank

http://c7.alamy.com/comp/BJ8F09/phantom ... BJ8F09.jpg" target="_blank

This page have a lot of prints and negatives, despite limited resolution, for vintage stars and films :

https://www.flickr.com/photos/alicejapan/albums/" target="_blank

Sadly it is not updated a long time ago.
Scott J wrote:There's definitely more than 8k (around 33 megapixels) worth of detail in these 8x10s struck off the original negatives. I purchased a couple prints from this collector to make sure he was legit. When scanning these prints, they out-resolve 800 DPI which is roughly 51 megapixels for an 8x10 - at least according to what I've read. I'm now staying around 1400 DPI scans to be safe. The exposure time for these older 8x10 plates usually result in motion blur for the actors, so there is that caveat.

For another example of detail, you may have seen this image in film books:
Image

And here's a crop from an original print made off the negative:
Image
Keep thinking...

Image

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Re: New Phantom of the Opera Website - Phantom1925.com

Unread post by Brianruns10 » Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:34 am

Is anyone aware of any new developments with the supposed forthcoming restoration of Phantom by Universal? There were news items that a reel of original Technicolor negative was discovered, comprising the beginning sequences of the '25 version.

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